WHITE COLLARS’s Matt Bomer and Tim DeKay Talk Role Reversals and Guest Stars in Season 5

By Liz | October 15, 2013

Last week I attended a telephone media press junket with Matt Bomer and Tim DeKay of White Collar. As we prepare for the show’s fifth season premiere we wonder about the role reversal for Peter and Neal, and just how is this situation effecting the characters. It was a pretty revealing Q&A and the boys gave us some pretty clear insights as well as a little fashion criticism from Matt on Tim’s new orange garb.

Don’t forget that White Collar has moved to Thursday nights beginning October 17th, at 9/8c on USA.

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Question: Can you talk about Warren Kole coming on board as Neal’s new handler?

Matt Bomer: Neal’s initial reaction to Warren’s character Siegel is one of trepidation because he is very by-the-books, by-the-numbers, and he’s an agent who’s gotten to where he is because he plays by the rules. And that’s – it’s obviously very threatening to Neal. And Warren did a great job of bringing lots of different aspects to the character and somehow making him charming and entertaining at the same time as being sort of a paint-inside-the-lines guy.

Tim DeKay: Peter was – he was concerned about this guy even though he brought him on and felt that he would be right for Neal because he felt that Neal needed somebody with – that could give some tough love from a – that has a
distance to Neal. Peter thought somebody from outside the New York Division would be better.

But there were some – there was trepidation as well on Peter’s part because with that, with handing over the reins, he no longer get to, you know, no longer gets awry. And that’s something Peter was going to miss. But as Matt said, I thought Warren did a fantastic job playing the role, and was able to find the right tenor for what was needed on our show and the kind of genre that we have.

Question: What is the trust status between Peter and Neal at this point?

DeKay: It’s a huge moment for Peter to recognize Neal going off anklet and even responding because at one point in the relationship it would have been cut and dry. He wants off the anklet, he’s going back to prison, no bones about it.

But, you know, this relationship has grown in such a way where Peter knows, for the most part, where Neal was coming from. But to address your, you know, your question of trust, I still maintain that if Peter ever implicitly trusts Neal about anything, I think then the relationship and the show for that matter takes a very sharp turn, and I think we lose a great tension if that trust is complete – is gained completely.

Question: Does Neal understand where Peter is coming from?

Bomer: This season for Neal is about best intentions going awry. And he’s feeling the sins of the father and, you know, has to skirt issues of trust to try to find some wiggle room to make reparations for what ultimately was his fault in terms of Peter’s future as an FBI agent, as a husband.

And so – but what I found the writers built over the course of this season which was interesting, was this sort of mounting resentment that he had these best intentions and was putting forth his best efforts and doing everything he knew how to help Peter, and that went, in his opinion, somewhat unappreciated.

Question: What is it like knowing that so many people from all parts of the world are responding to White Collar? What is it about the show that does that?

DeKay: Well, I can certainly speak to how it feels to know that the show is welcome in many parts of the world. It’s wonderful. I love it when I’m in New York or filming in New York and somebody from another country comes up and starts talking about an episode or is, you know, is complimentary to the show. I just – I think it’s great that there’s something about this relationship between the, you know, the cool criminal and the lawmen that is so universal.

Bomer: Yes, I had a really pivotal moment when we were filming a scene in Central Park this season and in between I was trying to take some time to visit with some fans take pictures and things, and it was like a map of the world between the pictures I was taking. One couple would be from Japan, the next was from Italy, the next was from Amsterdam. And it just went on and on.

And it was a really profound moment for me in terms of, you know, things you learn to appreciate as a show continues on into a fifth season, is that, you know, there’s something the writers have created and helpfully we have too in the relationships and the characters that does transcend cultural or idiosyncratic bounds of one country or another and seems to relate to a lot of different people.

And then of course the second place in my mind was, where are my foreign residuals?

I’m kidding. It was a really great moment to – a moment that made – reminded me of how grateful we should all be to be there on the show, because it meant a lot to get that kind of response from all these different places.

Question: Can you both talk about the role reversals this season?

Bomer: There was a moment when we were filming a scene in the prison and I saw Tim in an orange jumpsuit, you know, clearly complete role reversal and the coin being flipped. And I found that really interesting. Neal can obviously relate in many ways. He has a real sense of responsibility about everything that’s transpired, even though his father was largely responsible. He’s certainly feeling the weight of that as well.

And as someone who’s been where Peter is, I think that resonates with him even more, and makes him dig even deeper into his bag of tricks to figure out how to fix it. Like a typical guy, he wants to fix everything. And so I found – that’s how I view this from the character.

And from an actor’s perspective, I guess it wasn’t terribly different because we had – I guess it was just more surreal for me personally because we had filmed the opposite side of the coin before, so, first of all, Tim looks great in orange. Fantastic color for him. And secondly, you know, it was a bit of a – it was a trip to see him on the other side of things and see how he handles it.

And of course he’s such a great actor that I was just watching him planning on what I would steal in the next ten hours (in orange).

DeKay: Well, it was a trip to – I wish that – I wish that actually we explored that for a longer period of time even. I think that was – but, you know, story-wise we couldn’t, but I thought that would have been interesting had we kind of stretched it out a bit longer.

Question: Peter basically acknowledges that he doesn’t have the objectivity anymore to keep an eye on Neal. Were you glad to see him take that moment and have that speech? Do you think it was a humbling moment for Peter at all?

DeKay: I – you know what? That’s an interesting question. I don’t necessarily feel that it was – it should have been a humbling moment for Peter. It was a disappointing moment for Peter. And he was upset because it meant – he had – unfortunately, he had to throw out the baby with the bathwater and it was upsetting for Peter because it meant not being able to do the things that he love to do with Neal which is, you know, pursue a case and do the chase.

So that’s what Peter found most upsetting. And also I think Peter finds Neal a – now has a personal investment with this guy. And if he fails- if that relationship, that partnership fails, then Peter has failed.

Question: What will the relationship be like between Neal and Mark Shappard’s character?

Bomer: Mark is an amazing baddie as I’m sure you all know from the many TV series you’ve covered when he plays baddies. You know, it’s that deal with the devil. He has Neal under his thumb, which is obviously, especially for someone like Neal, not a very comfortable place for him to be. He has him at his beck and call and, you know, the – basically he can have Neal do whatever illicit behavior he doesn’t want to have to take responsibility for to himself. Neal can’t really put that much of a fight about it.

I can’t go into too much detail without giving away certain episodes, but it’s not a fun place for Neal to be and really doesn’t have a leg to stand on in terms of opposition.

Question: Will the show again explore the relationship between Neal and his father (Treat Williams)?

Bomer: That was a storyline that I feel like needed to be fleshed out at some point, you know, at a certain point as television series progress, and have everybody get a little bit more into people’s backstories. I think with someone like Neal, it’s a little dangerous if we start to know too much about him because he is, you know, essentially, Jeff said, an almost a fantastical character in some ways.

I had a blast playing out those storylines with Treat and, you know, putting some of those pieces together for Neal, but we will not be exploring that any further in this season. This season really gets back to more of the early season White Collar mythology, strong themes of good versus evil and trust and without going into too much detail about Neal’s past.

Although – what Neal experienced from his relationship with his father and the things that I got to explore with Treat really resonate throughout this season and ultimately the emphasis for everything that transpires this season — the sins of the father weighed pretty heavily into all the decisions Neal makes and sort of spur us into action this season. And so you feel that relationship even though it’s not there.

Question: How do you view the relationship between Peter and Neal?

DeKay: I’ve always – I have this image of these two guys as very close friends. And I have this image of them playing poker together and enjoying it and realizing that nobody could really play the kinds of poker, the level of poker the other one does except with that other person. And I see them enjoying a game and having a good time with it, but never ever, ever showing each other’s hands, and constantly bluffing or trying to bid differently. But again, never showing the other hand to the other person. But yet needing that game and learning from that game.

I don’t know, sometimes Peter is a father to Neal, sometimes he is a friend to him, and other times he’s his boss. It’s layered. It’s a lot of different relationships.

Bomer: Yes. It changes a lot. But for me, it always goes back more to the familial with Peter, whether that be fraternal or paternal or sometimes, you know, a family member you have to work with. But for me it always goes back to the more familial because, much like a family member, Peter is the one character who is a source of stability in Neal’s life in a strange way because he has – the only person Neal has been spending time with and there’s healthy boundaries.

In regard of what happens, what transpires, he knows what the mathematical formula is with Peter. If he does X, then he will get Y. And to me that’s sort of like family, because you can, you know, go out into the world and make
mistakes and grow or change and you come back and family is still there with dinner on the table.

Question: How is Peter’s situation effecting Elizabeth?

DeKay: It affects it greatly, and Elizabeth’s main concern is to get her husband back regardless of what it means to his career, what it means to anything. She just wants her husband back and out of prison.

And when big things like this happen, these two people, you know, they take a look at their lives and they take a look at how they – how Peter got to that place, and they, you know, they reassess and figure out what is the best way to go forward. And as Matt said, it’s a lot of – big issues come up this season with where people are headed, what people are made of, and what they want to make of with their lives.

Bomer: He’s fed up with Neal’s antics and rightfully so. He’s got his own life to get back to.

Question: What’s up with Neal’s love life this season?

Bomer: There is a really incredible girl who comes in Neal’s life named Rebecca Lowe played by the gorgeous and talented Bridget Regan, who is (initially) sort of atypical in terms of what Neal finds attractive in a woman, with the exception of the fact that she’s a redhead. And their relationship grows over the course of the season and I think the writers did a great job just making the character really multidimensional. And she’s – her character is sort of like an onion, every episode a new layer, peels off, and we get to – Neal gets to know more about her and becomes more attracted to her.

Question: Can you share a funny story on Willie Garson’s directorial debut?

Bomer: Willie showed up to work on the first day for the first scene in full Cecil B. De Mille regalia. I’d like to put that out there. He had on the (rider pants), the (riding crop) in his hand, and the megaphone, with a beret. Yes. So that was our introduction to Willie as director.

I found him to be profoundly organized, really hands-on when he needed to be and really hands-off when he felt like the show was in its – in a zone that everybody at this point knows how to keep it in, and a real joy.

DeKay: Yes, I agree. He was – he came prepared to the party. And was ready to just be there for you when you needed him as an actor.

Yes, he was – he knew what he wanted. And it was – directed the episode where we had the great, lovely and talented Kim Dickens who played Peter’s old girlfriend. And Willie was able to add some wonderful pieces to that and give us a nice tone to that.

Question: What is the most important thing that Neal and Peter have learned from each other?

DeKay: The most important thing that I think Peter has learned from Neal is how to wear a suit, how to wear a tie, and be able to do your cuff links on your own. And then below that would be to look at the grey a little bit more than just the black and white all the time. And perhaps realize that the grey can get you to the black and white in a good way.

Bomer: I would say that Neal has learned to look at the black and white kind of a little bit more and not always live in the grey. And not to repeat myself too much, but I think he’s learned about boundaries and responsibility, and a little tiny bit about managing impulses.

DeKay: Yes, that’s the thing. I mean in a way it’s – boy, that touches – I – there will be a part of Peter that wouldn’t want Neal to manage all of his impulses because that’s part of Neal that’s incredibly valuable to Peter’s job. See, that’s – I think that’s what’s great about this relationship, is that it, you know, – the bad line for Neal is, well, Peter, this is why you grabbed me, because I do this kind of stuff. And if you change me completely, you lose what – the value that I give to this partnership.

Question for DeKay: Has directing changed your perception of acting or influenced your vision of the show?

DeKay: Directing hasn’t changed my perception on acting. It has opened my eyes more to what it takes to produce a television show in just seven days and how amazing our crew is and how they are able to make wonderful creative and logistical decisions on the fly to create just an incredible-looking show in the short amount of time that we have to produce 42 minutes of television.

And I have to say, it’s a joy. It is a joy to sit down at the monitors and watch my fellow cast members act. It really is. There’s a scene between Matt and Bridget in my episode that just I could have – I could have just watched it all day. And it’s just the two of them sitting down talking, and just how facile both of them were and realizing what story points needed to come out, it was a joy. So I get to do that, I get to watch the monitor and watch my – all my fellow actors, including not just Matt, Willie and Tiffani and Sharif and Marsha.

Because Matt knows all his lines. That’s the thing I’m most impressed about him.

Question: Can you talk about the guest stars coming on this season and are there any in particular you’d like to work with again?

Bomer: Yes. There’s an amazing actress named Elizabeth Marvel who’s a great stage actress in New York and is also in a lot of the Coen Brothers movies. And she came on and played a psychiatrist in one episode. And Neal gets to have (similarly) fun scenes with her in her office undercover, and she was a blast to get to work with. We had an amazing time together.

We have Zachary Booth from Damages who’s great. Aforementioned Warren Kole, Mark Sheppard, Bridget Regan, and this cool other girl Kara Hayward from the movie Moonrise Kingdom who is really fine, sweet.

DeKay: And another person that was great to play with was Zelijko Ivanek.

Bomer: Yes, great actor, on the New York stage a lot of times. And we just got the whole cast of Damages basically.

DeKay: It would be great to see all of them back in one way. I thought – maybe because I ran into him in the hallway, Aidan Quinn, who’s doing now Elementary, and so it was – it reminded me of his episode. I thought it would be great to have him back. You know, everybody. You know, I hate to just point out one person because we’ve been very lucky with guest stars.

And you know, here’s somebody who I consider almost a series regular but is not, strong recurring, would be James Rebhorn. I’d love to have Hughes come back.

Bomer: Yes, that would be great. You don’t want to single anybody, you know, because we’ve – I think we’ve had incredible guest stars who we’ve all learned a lot from and had a great time with and we never had a bad egg in the bunch. So I’d welcome anybody…

DeKay: Yes. Beau Bridges.

Bomer: It’s like you start mentioning people, you feel like, well, we got to mention everybody, but. The thing about James Rebhorn, is not only is he a great actor, but he has some amazing recipes that he brings. So he – so he’s, you know, there’s that. He’s a good cook.

Question: Is Peter going to regret bringing in Warren Kole as Neal’s handler like he regretted bringing in Kramer to investigate the U-boat treasure?

DeKay: Yes. Oh, baby. Let’s see. I don’t think we’ll regret it at all. I think if anything, it would have been nice to have – to have seen more of Warren, and certainly David Siegel, agent David Siegel.

You know, I think just that whole – that goes back to my talk about having to have done maybe stretched out a little bit more Peter in prison, I think would have been fun to stretch out Siegel. But, you know, this is not a comment on the writing. You completely understand why they have to do the things they do. But it’s more of a comment on how much I thought Warren brought to the role and just the dynamic between Peter, Neal and David Siegel.

Question: Using a Breaking Bad analogy, Neal is a bit like Walter White. He does bad things, he breaks the law, but we still want him to win and we still back him. But it gets to a point where it feels like he’s hurt enough people, especially the people who love him, and you just want him to really pay the price. Why should the audience and why should Peter still keep believing that he can be redeemed?

Bomer: You have to look at the motivations for the behavior. And if you look at Neal’s intentions, really from the beginning of the series, even when he’s still on things in his past, in his early years, he always says to Mozzie it’s never about the money. It’s more about the game.

And certainly in the framework of this season, everything he does that (trades) around in the gray area is motivated from a place of love and best intentions. The execution I think that happen is where he gets into trouble. But at the end of the day, his motives are somewhat pure. And if I were Peter, I would have kicked the sh*! out of Neal by now, to be honest with you.

But I do think that if we (moved) that mutual respect and appreciation, the show would really lose its – a big part of its central relationship. And I think, credit to Tim, is as far out as the writers have Neal go to execute things, he, over the course of the years, has really done a great job of (rounding) the show.

You know, Peter is really the roots of the show. He is the one who is our stasis, is our solid ground. And Tim has found a great way, and the writers, have found great ways to have Peter still respect and value Neal in spite of all the grief he’s caused everyone.

DeKay: I think – I think that there had been times where Peter would like to beat the sh*! out of Neal. But Peter also see that Neal is coming from the right place. He sees that the guy is not greedy, that he certainly doesn’t want to ever physically harm anybody. But sometimes jeopardizes other people’s lives and maybe doesn’t quite think that through. But yes, that’s the thing. If we went – then it would just be – then it would — I don’t know. It’s like Tom and Jerry. If Tom really wants to – I mean, yes, he wants to get the mouse, but.

If Peter were just wanting to get Neal and get him back into prison and realize, ah, I should not hire this guy, I shouldn’t have brought this guy out, I don’t know, that’s kind of been done and that’s not nearly as interesting as a constant tug of war.

Question: The show never gets old and it’s always enjoyable. How long do both of you guys foresee being able to do the show?

DeKay: If the show were — I’ll be honest with you — if the show were in Los Angeles and me and my family, I would do it for 25 years. I would do it until Neal was in the walker and Tim – Peter was in a (jazzy) and we’re doing walk and talk that way down the street.

Because it’s not, it is a great role and…

Bomer: And I – I mean the writers have just given us a slew of interesting and layered bad guys and a slew of different worlds to pursue those bad guys. And we have a crew that cares and it’s wonderful and has invested in the story.

Question: Throughout the five seasons, both Peter and Neal have gone through so many changes. Which ones have stuck out to you and which ones have you like read in the script, went, oh my God, we’re doing that?

Bomer: Mine would relate mostly to I guess previous (season) when we were divided up into two seasons, the mid-season finale and the finales, because I feel like that’s generally when Jeff Eastin would reach way into his bag of tricks and suddenly I was (dazed) jumping off the top of a building or, you know, doing just some drastic extreme in terms of Neal’s own physical well-being and welfare, whatever it may be. So it would definitely, you know, there’s cliffhangers that Jeff would write that I would read and say, wow, okay, this is what it’s all about (too). But I’d never — very rarely, I think if ever — read anything I thought, oh, this is too far, this doesn’t make sense, or this is.

There is sort of a fantastical, whimsical element to the show that, you know, you have to suspend your disbelief a little bit on the show, otherwise you’re, you know, if you’re looking at this as a sheer procedural or cold hard facts, it all makes sense, you know, you’re going to bump into some walls. And so I think because we gave ourselves that permission in the first season, you know, it’s been fun for us to get to come up with ways to justify and back up why our characters do what they do.

Question: Can you talk about filming in New York?

DeKay: I – there is something about filming in New York for New York that is – it’s liberating, at least for me. The – creatively you just get – you could just stretch out and not have to contain yourself both visually and creatively. There are no restrictions. I love it when we have a walk-and-talk in New York. And undoubtedly, the director, the VP, (Bob Kantz) have created some gorgeous shot where you see a beautiful skyline and it pans down to the two of us walking. And you’re aware of that as an actor. And it’s wonderful. And it’s, you’re right, New York is another character. And I love working with that other character.

Bomer: New York is my favorite city and place. I first moved as a young artist. So whenever I’m there, I have that excitement and that enthusiasm that I think I had to channel that from when I first lived there. And it just never runs out of surprising new places. The first few seasons were so – it was – I like a kid in a candy store because we were filming in all these iconic locations that when you first move to New York you think, oh, that’s near Columbus Circle or that’s in Central Park.

And we were filming at all these places and it continually surprises us. I mean we – the finale films in this place called Fort Totten that’s out in Queens, and who knew that that place, this giant old military base, was out in Queens, (on a water). I mean there are always places like that every season.

Getting to film, as a New Yorker, everyone has access to the amazing exteriors of places, but getting to see the insides of these amazing brownstones and… Brooklyn and Manhattan, had been a really incredible and I feel that
we’ve been privileged to see some of the most beautiful homes in New York.

DeKay: I agree. I found myself being equally as excited to walk in and discover some amazing townhouse or penthouse that has an amazing view as much as I was blown over when we were at Yankee Stadium. All these, you know, just open these doors to these townhouses or, you know, you take a private elevator up to some penthouse and the door opens, and you’re just amazed as to the… beauty that – the view that place has and the beauty of the place itself.

Bomer: It’s always a litmus test for me, people will sometimes come up and say, talk about the show or I’ll engage them in conversation, then say, where do you film that? And as soon as they ask that question, I know they’re not – they don’t watch the show. Because you can’t watch the show and not have an appreciation for New York.